[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by FloridaGuy66

This is completely accurate and I'm shocked that so many people seem to think these are the desirable jobs that we need more of here.

Most people doing these types of jobs for 20+ years have their bodies so beaten down from repetitive tasks that there's no golf or pickleball options in their retirement, even if they could somehow afford it. Their "retirement" is basically sitting in front of a TV for the reminder of their lives.

If they could afford it, I'll bet they would surprise you.

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Pay and quality of life suffer where there are no UNIONS.

if employees were treated fairly, decent pay, benefits, there would be no unions.
Employers who do not value the employees and only want to exploit them are the reason unions came to be.

[FloridaGuy66]

Originally Posted by fdpaq0580

If they could afford it, I'll bet they would surprise you.

I worked in an automotive manufacturing facility for 7 years as a consultant. I was more surprised by the many people I met that were working on the assembly line that reached retirement age and became deceased in their 60's or no longer have any physical ability to do anything enjoyable in their retirement. I've learned that those jobs totally suck the life out of you literally.

[MorTech]

Young people want free money taken buy force from those who earn it.

China is not in play...It is now Vietnam (Vingroup is the next Samsung ), Cambodia, Thailand, Indonesia, Philippines and Malaysia.

Wonder why they were first to the negotiating table?

[AMB444]

"China owns cheap manufacturing now "

Yes, of course. But for how long. We think of the Chinese as dirt poor and having no access to internet and other worldly news.

How long before they, as well as us, decide enough is enough.

[Normal]

Originally Posted by AMB444

"China owns cheap manufacturing now "

Yes, of course. But for how long. We think of the Chinese as dirt poor and having no access to internet and other worldly news.

How long before they, as well as us, decide enough is enough.

That was the mindset of 10-15 years ago. We don’t live in 2010 anymore. They are much more westernized than many think. More than half of the Chinese population is obese and many don’t work.

They have a 1 trillion dollar trade surplus that has been stealing from the American GDP for some time. We aren’t the only country the feels this way either,. The EU, Australia and others all are being bullied by China.

China has access to a lot of technology thanks to our colleges supporting Chinese students for at least 5 years. Something needs to be done. We might suffer discomfort a year or so in a full out trade war, but it’s China who would be crawling back on their knees about this time next year.

[SallyB]

Originally Posted by salpal

agree....can you imagine Americans sewing blue jeans in a factory for very small wages? We want to encourage young people to STEM careers. People forget...the robots are coming. Do we want the USA to go back to the 1800's with factories? No, we want to be supreme in technology and all STEM areas.

You are truly missing what manufacturing in the US means.
Go back to 2021 when we couldn't buy items needed and most important medications
why do we need our medications made in other countries?
The auto industry came to a stop because the US outsourced its chips
there is no reason that the US should be crippled because we rely on other countries
We have moved US companies to other countries because of cheap labor and taxes. Better taxes and insurance for companies can make them competitive.
China has done nothing but hurts the US wake up

[PilotAlan]

How quickly everyone forgets the pandemic. When we discovered that our medications, PPE, repair parts for almost everything, and thousands of other critical items were made overseas.
We have an expansionist China threatening war, and we're dependent on them for the steel to make our ships and tanks. The computer parts of our fighter jets (and for our internet, and phones, and everything else).

We have made ourselves dependent on our enemies for almost everything that is critical to maintaining our defense, our industry, our health, our communications, and almost everything else.
This isn't about blue jeans and tchotchkies. This is about losing the ability to make almost anything in this country. That's not a good prescription for our economy, our defense, or our future.

[justjim]

Interesting Thread. What are you going to do with the millions of Americans on “public aid”’of various types? I read recently that 40% of Americans cannot come up with $400.00 in cash. That would be 140 million plus folks. And we are the most prosperous and greatest country on the planet! The divide between the rich and poor is a GREAT divide and our “leaders” won’t “touch it with a 10 foot pole”. Fore.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by PilotAlan

How quickly everyone forgets the pandemic. When we discovered that our medications, PPE, repair parts for almost everything, and thousands of other critical items were made overseas.
We have an expansionist China threatening war, and we're dependent on them for the steel to make our ships and tanks. The computer parts of our fighter jets (and for our internet, and phones, and everything else).

We have made ourselves dependent on our enemies for almost everything that is critical to maintaining our defense, our industry, our health, our communications, and almost everything else.
This isn't about blue jeans and tchotchkies. This is about losing the ability to make almost anything in this country. That's not a good prescription for our economy, our defense, or our future.

So we're driving into a brick wall, and the solution is to destroy the car, and then rebuild it - leaving everyone with no transportation until a new one is made.

That - is a pretty stupid idea.

Here's a different idea:

Build a new car, and stop driving it into brick walls.

We're driving our country toward a recession because we want to not use Chinese products.

Okay so...
Instead of making everyone in America suffer by increasing the costs of those products (which is what happens when you impose tariffs)...

start making those products in America FIRST. THEN ease off on the imports.

[Paper1]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

The Debt could EASILY be repaid merely by changing the tax brackets to make the top brackets pay more (their fair share). But, it may be too late. We may have lost our Democracy already.

What you proposed sounds like socialism and you maybe correct. You mention Democracy but need to understand what the impact of 50% of eligible voters do not pay a cent of federal income tax. Their vote counts every bit as much as that person who you say is not “paying their fair share”. That is what will kill democracy. IMHO

[elevatorman]

Originally Posted by Normal

We have many shuttered facilities for auto manufacturing that could be reopened within weeks too. I say bring those incomes back from Canada and Mexico. Let’s pay Americans to do those jobs first.

Steel plants could fire up production within the month.
US Steel will cut jobs, close plants, move HQ from Pittsburgh if Nippon sale fails, CEO warns

US Steel is not what it once was.
US Steel produced 8.8 million metric tons of steel in 2022. Nucor Corporation (Charlotte, NC) produced 20.5 million metric tons, and Cleveland-Cliffs Inc. (Cleveland, OH) produced 16.5 million metric tons.

US Steel did not start to modernize its plants until 2010. They still rely on coal blast furnaces in the Pittsburgh area. While most other US companies use electric arc furnace (EAF) that are more efficient.

79% of the steel used in the US is made in the US. The industry is undergoing a transformation, with significant investments in modernizing facilities and adopting more sustainable production methods, such as electric arc furnaces (EAFs). For instance, BlueScope's North Star steelworks in Ohio has invested over $1 billion in expanding its EAF operations, contributing to a resurgence in U.S. manufacturing. ​

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

So we're driving into a brick wall, and the solution is to destroy the car, and then rebuild it - leaving everyone with no transportation until a new one is made.

That - is a pretty stupid idea.

Here's a different idea:

Build a new car, and stop driving it into brick walls.

We're driving our country toward a recession because we want to not use Chinese products.

Okay so...
Instead of making everyone in America suffer by increasing the costs of those products (which is what happens when you impose tariffs)...

start making those products in America FIRST. THEN ease off on the imports.

Sounds simple. Where do we get the materials? The expertise? The equipment? The food?
We import it.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Normal

That was the mindset of 10-15 years ago. We don’t live in 2010 anymore. They are much more westernized than many think. More than half of the Chinese population is obese and many don’t work.

They have a 1 trillion dollar trade surplus that has been stealing from the American GDP for some time. We aren’t the only country the feels this way either,. The EU, Australia and others all are being bullied by China.

China has access to a lot of technology thanks to our colleges supporting Chinese students for at least 5 years. Something needs to be done. We might suffer discomfort a year or so in a full out trade war, but it’s China who would be crawling back on their knees about this time next year.

I think that trade between partners will OFTEN not be EQUAL. That is no big deal. Most Chinese can NOT afford to buy US products. For one thing the currencies are NOT equal.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

The national debt is a huge problem but needs to be approached from every angle. Roads, bridges, the military, public universities, rail lines, etc. are also part of the problem. These are needed though. Stupid expenditures is not a solution. We need a smart approach to spending money. And one that considers future generations and their needs, problems, etc. Get everyone aboard with finding a practical solution.

The national debt over recent years is because MONEY OUT (from all expenses) exceeds the MONEY IN (from taxes). That is a simplification. The problem is that since about 1990 the tax brackets have favored the top 10% not the middle class. ANY country without a STRONG middle class is going to end up in a DICTATORSHIP. The tax bracket manipulation since 1990 should concern every AMERICAN, but most are unaware.